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Bertrand's ACE Debate


Debate Info

70
88
Change cultural mascots Keep cultural mascots
Debate Score:158
Arguments:65
Total Votes:198
More Stats

Argument Ratio

side graph
 
 Change cultural mascots (31)
 
 Keep cultural mascots (33)

Debate Creator

mbertrand(62) pic



15fall cultural mascots

Change cultural mascots

Side Score: 70
VS.

Keep cultural mascots

Side Score: 88
2 points

Native American mascots stereotype all Native Americans as one image. The Native Americans I know dress in shirts and pants, or in other words they dress like normal people do. If I didn’t know any Native Americans in real life I might think that they all look like the mascot. Because people stereotype for example the mascots people automatically think that all Native Americans dress this way. So this causes the Native Americans in real life to have to fight the stereotype image.

Side: Change cultural mascots
Ketner(4) Disputed
1 point

You are basically saying that all teams that have native american names and mascots are meant to stereotype native americans, and you are completely wrong. These teams are trying to support native american culture. Actually Daniel Snyder said that the redskins where named after the first coach, William Henry, to support and respect his native american heritage. Also, just like Logan said, these are ethnic stereotypes. That would be like saying that all caucasian (white) people dress where cowboy hats and ride horse because the dallas cowboys mascot is a cowboy.

Side: Keep cultural mascots
2 points

Redskin is a racist thing toward Native Americans because it refers to the scalps of Native Americans early settlers would sell and trade, and using the headbands with feathers and stuff is a sign of disrespect towards the Native Americans because in order to do that you would have to go through a lot of battle etc.

Side: Change cultural mascots
2 points

Most of the feathers and other decorations are highly offensive when people at like highschool games dress up like that and make fun of the ways that those are earned.

Side: Change cultural mascots
21ebeardsley(4) Disputed
3 points

I disagree because even though these might be stereotyping they are used to prove a point with the strength of the people. They are not to hurt they are meant to empower the people and the heritage behind it.

Side: Keep cultural mascots
21rjohnson(7) Disputed
2 points

I disagree with 21kcoulter (below this post), because actually, the feathers are called "war feathers". And that symbolizes how many times they have fought for their culture or tribe. So really, the "war feathers" are actually respecting the culture, braveness, courage, and the history of the Native Americans.

Side: Keep cultural mascots
2 points

The people who make the mascots stereotype the native americans like when they use the fake war calls at games because native americans never used those, or when they think of them as cannibals and bloodthirsty because that is offensive and they don't do any of those things.

Side: Change cultural mascots
2 points

Why can’t people change the mascot to a more respectable figure and why don’t people understand that it’s offensive. An article stated, an Ann Arbor resident said that her organization has been making headway in recent years and and has gotten a few area teams to change their mascot to a more respectable figure. The term redskin is very offencive, as it refers to the scalps of the Native Americans, which early settlers would sell and trade along with pelts of animals. People are starting to agree to change the mascots of their team. Dr. Quartey said, “ I cut the logo off,” after he found out the term’s meaning.

Supporting Evidence: Link (docs.google.com)
Side: Change cultural mascots
2 points

Why can’t people change the mascot to a more respectable figure and why don’t people understand that it’s offensive. An article stated, an Ann Arbor resident said that her organization has been making headway in recent years and and has gotten a few area teams to change their mascot to a more respectable figure. The term redskin is very offensive, as it refers to the scalps of the Native Americans, which early settlers would sell and trade along with pelts of animals. People are starting to agree to change the mascots of their team. Dr. Quartey said, “ I cut the logo off,” after he found out the term’s meaning.

Supporting Evidence: Link (docs.google.com)
Side: Change cultural mascots
2 points

I think that they should change the name of the mascot because it would keep people from having an excuse to protest about everything that offends them. There are too many people that find every reason to complain about one subject or another. This is just one area where we could prevent that. Margaret Carey said, "I was appalled, but I can't say I was totally surprised. People today feel like they can state their differences and points of view by riots and protests and other illegal actions.

Side: Change cultural mascots
1 point

People find school mascots offensive. I agree because Mr. Cooper’s daughter was so offended by a cheerleader dressed as an American Indian that her eyes filled with tears and asked to leave the football game. To quote Mr. Cooper “I taught my children to respect warriors because they are veterans of battle. That girl doesn’t understand that every feather in that headdress would have been earned in battle.” People don’t understand that something as little as that can mean such a big thing to someone else. Mr. Cooper also said, “She wouldn’t know that each one represents a life that was taken. (The cheerleader) was making a mockery of us.” Therefore, people should change the mascots so we can all be ally's.

Supporting Evidence: School Mascots (docs.google.com)
Side: Change cultural mascots
21lwarner(8) Disputed
3 points

I disagree with you because cultural mascots are meant to pay amish to the culture not to offend anyone. Also are not portrayed to be rude to the native culture. Therefore I think that they should not change the cultural mascots.

Side: Keep cultural mascots
21lcoffey(11) Disputed
2 points

Even though it's not meant to offend anyone it's still stereotypical.

Side: Change cultural mascots
21jmaguire Disputed
2 points

What you are saying is completely wrong cultural mascots are not meant to hurt anyone.(as Logan said in one of his statement) The girl was just thinking the wrong thing by thinking that it is a bad thing. Many of the Indians that live in places where there high school support the name if it is about there culture.

Side: Keep cultural mascots
21ssorenson(3) Disputed
1 point

How does someone think wrong about their own opinion? I'm just having a hard time understanding how you have a wrong opinion

Side: Change cultural mascots
21lcoffey(11) Disputed
0 points

I don't think she was thinking the wrong thing I think she was thinking what her dad taught her. To quote Mr. Cooper “I taught my children to respect warriors because they are veterans of battle."

Supporting Evidence: Link (docs.google.com)
Side: Change cultural mascots
21lcoffey(11) Disputed
2 points

Mr. Cooper and 5 other Native American spoke on a panel one night in hopes that bringing the attention about the diverse culture in Monroe county. Mr. Cooper and the others shared their own personal stories. They also brought up historical events. The opposing side brought up that it was a sign of respect, but Mr. Cooper kept fighting for what he believed in. Shouldn't we all help Mr.Cooper?

Supporting Evidence: Link (docs.google.com)
Side: Keep cultural mascots
21jmaguire Disputed
2 points

NO we should not all help Mr. Cooper because it is actually helping the team and the culture because most teams will have a hall of fame which most of the time has why they got the name and who decided why. and then the culture becomes more popular and the team because the people of that culture root for them to to keep the name of the culture out there for people to know.

Source the redskins wall/hall of fame

Side: Change cultural mascots
1 point

We should change mascots because when Abel Cooper’s daughter a Native American saw a Cheerleader running around in a headdress and Buckskin clothing she started crying and asked if they could leave. That is because they are making fools out of Indians the headdress that the cheerleader was wearing had feathers on it each feather could have been earned in battle they we making a mockery of them.

Side: Change cultural mascots
21jmaguire Disputed
1 point

If you look to my last two posts then you will see the right answer lies in the text.

Side: Keep cultural mascots
21ssorenson(3) Disputed
2 points

So what if the are not meant to hurt anyone if they do saying they're not meant to doesn't make it any better

Side: Change cultural mascots
1 point

Some mascot are just stereotypes of races or figures like the mascot at a California high school Is just a stereotypical depiction of a arab man. In the halls of the high school they have depictions magic lamps and flying carpets stereotypical items of the middle east made famous by movies

Side: Change cultural mascots
6 points

Money

We should not change the cultural mascots because, this country is already in debt, we need to worry about other things in our country than this because it would cost a lot of money to have all the logos removed.

Dan Snyder (owner of the Washington Redskins) says that it would cost him millions of dollars to recall the logos.

Therefore I think that we should not change the cultural mascots.

Side: Keep cultural mascots
21ssorenson(3) Disputed
4 points

So what if it cost him "millions" of dollars to recall the logo it's the least he could do because that team name has offended many of native Americans .

Side: Change cultural mascots
21jmaguire Disputed
4 points

but then that money would be wasted on things that don't matter at all like what if they were saving there for a better fan experience like better seats or better food.

Side: Keep cultural mascots
21mhay(5) Disputed
0 points

We are in a world where everyone is trying to be the same. Culture and heritage is disappearing in society. I think they should change them because Native Americans are very much into saving their heritage. Their wasy of life should be left and honored that way. Their way of life had nothing to do with sports.

Side: Keep cultural mascots
5 points

Not meant to hurt anyone.

We should not change the cultural mascots because, Mascots are not portrayed to be rude to the native culture that the mascot is from, it is more to pay amish to the native culture. According to the Washington Redskins.The use of native names or symbols by non-native teams to be harmful form of ethnic stereotype. Native Americans should be honored to have teams that represent their bravery, courage, and strength and fighting skills. Therefore I don't think that we should switch cultural mascots.

Side: Keep cultural mascots
21mhay(5) Disputed
1 point

the Washinton Redskins mascot is not a controversy with all Native Americans, however, it is the majority. There are many teams besides the Redskins that have names relating to Native Americans. They are not the only culture that is upset by a derogatory symbol..

Side: Change cultural mascots
4 points

We should keep the mascots because it would cost tons of money to switch them. Not to mention that according the Dr.Benva, “It takes an average of $800-$1,000 to change the mascot, along with the logo, and all the other needed things.” This might even result the school to shut down if it’s low on money in the first place, and then has to pay to switch. Therefore, we should keep the mascots.

Side: Keep cultural mascots
21lcoffey(11) Disputed
3 points

If it only takes $800-$1000 we should be able to change the mascot because our country probably spend millions of dollars or stuff that doesn't need to be changed such as making roads smoother, we can use the money to change the mascots to make the Native Americans feel like their included in our country.

Side: Change cultural mascots
21jmaguire Disputed
3 points

but what is more important road for safety or things that don't matter like the mascot just because a little girl thinks it is wrong then well she messed up. because safety of this nation is more important than a mascot.

Side: Keep cultural mascots
4 points

The natives don't care then why should we.

Daniel Snyder says that in the native American's eyes this actually help build the culture.

Supporting Evidence: Mascots help (mmqb.si.com)
Side: Keep cultural mascots
21lcoffey(11) Disputed
4 points

Some Natives care. Plus how do you know that Daniel Snyder knows that through the Native's eyes helps build the character.

Side: Change cultural mascots
21jmaguire Disputed
3 points

But majority say that it doesn't offend them. plus if they have a native american chief before every game run on a horse to the middle and stab the ground with a staff.

Side: Keep cultural mascots
21mhay(5) Disputed
1 point

There are more Native Americans that are offended than are not. They respect and cherish their culture. They don't want to be put into a category where people name them after sports that have to do with conflict and violence. Each and every mascot shows an Indian with tomahawks, or spears with war paint.

Side: Change cultural mascots
3 points

My last reason exclaims that, it takes a lot of money to change everything about your school’s logo and mascot. For example, according to Allen Adamson, a branding expert with Landor Associates, it can take 15 million dollars to rebrand a NFL team. That’s as much money as about 75 Lamborghini Gallardos (which cost about $200,000 each car). Using the Buffalo Bills as an example, 15 million dollars is actually 7% of their whole net worth (which is 1.4 billion dollars). Plus, rebranding the whole team would not only costs a lot of money, it really drops the, if you will, “mini economy” for that team. Money all of the sudden drops because of taking away that not only iconic (money making) logo, but most of all it takes away mounds of money for that team. And that will break the stocks for the NFL AND that team.

Side: Keep cultural mascots
3 points

Also, Just to make a NFL stadium, it costs about 850 million dollars, and to have your team rise to an elite team in the NFL, that could cost around an extra 100 to 300 million dollars. So after it is all said and done with, the cost to make an NFL team hovers around a whopping 1 billion dollars. But, back to the 15 million dollars to rebrand your team, 15 million dollars is a lot of money. And for a starter team in the NFL, that could mean the end of their franchise, meaning that they’d have to sell it, or just stop the whole franchise, and likely one other, because they would not want an odd number of teams do to schedule.

http://www.athleticbusiness.com/stadium-arena/how-stadium-construction-costs-reached-the-billions.html

Side: Keep cultural mascots
3 points

people curently belive that since a mascot depicts a race means that it is belittling the race when in reality thay are tryiong to show the races power. I personaly disagree with said people because yes they might be given a racialy backround but they are not meant to dimeaner

Side: Keep cultural mascots
2 points

Not all people believe that the names are offensive and many actually believe that they are supposed to honour their people and congratulate them on becoming the people they are ,and they can also be heard saying that they believe they are a simple power a simble that empowers people. like when Florida State kept its Seminole mascot after receiving support from Seminoles tribes.

Side: Keep cultural mascots
21lcoffey(11) Disputed
3 points

I agree that not all people are offended but it stereotypes them. Native Americans that live in the U.S. are diverse. Each tribe has its own culture and way of life. Long ago they had different clothes, houses, and languages. Mascots make it seem like all Native Americans look one way or wear the same clothes. This doesn’t honor each tribes individual culture or way of life.

Side: Change cultural mascots
2 points

We should not change the mascots, we should keep them. I think that because people in general don’t like the change. For instance, in Marquette High School, their Chief. They took the mascot away, resulting an angry riot of 1,200 people of the Marquette community. And as you can see people don’t like the change, they had a protest against it. Even though some people may want to change the mascot, the majority of the people want to leave it where it is, therefore, we should keep the mascots.

Side: Keep cultural mascots
2 points

Team

We should not change cultural mascots because, there are some teams with cultural names that people don't rant about and make a big deal out of it. For example the Notre Dame Fighting Irish, people don't make a big deal about their team mascot. Therefore I think that we should not change cultural mascots.

Side: Keep cultural mascots
21lcoffey(11) Disputed
3 points

Logan how do you know that people don't rant about the Notre Dame Fighting Irish.

Side: Change cultural mascots
21jmaguire Disputed
3 points

BECAUSE YOU JUST OFFENDED ME BY SAYING THAT THE FIGHTING IRISH DIDN'T FIGHT TO BE FREE FROM ENGLAND. BECAUSE US IRISH FIGHT JUST TO STAY ALIVE.

Side: Keep cultural mascots
2 points

The whole aspect of a mascot is to have a figure that empowers the people and if people believe that it is focusing on one race. That's because it is it is showing that they are a strong group that deserves remembrance an example. Is when in the report written by Elizabeth A she found that "journalists’ views on the issue and found some journalists argued that people are becoming too sensitive to the possible offensiveness in language and there was no reason for changing the names.

Side: Keep cultural mascots
21kcoulter(3) Disputed
4 points

I disagree because some of this "Too sensitive stuff" is really a sign of offense because, if you were considered bloodthirsty even though you are peaceful even when your land is stripped from you, you would find that offensive.

Side: Change cultural mascots
2 points

We should keep the mascots, leave them where they are, because people like the traditional. You may say that traditions don’t matter, but for some people they do. According to Sarah Seekatz-a historian and Ph.D candidate-, “It’s ingrained for people who have been there for quite a while, they grew up with it”. What she means is that for some people, the mascot is what they’ve been raised with, it brought good memories, good times, happy times, and at the thought that they would lose all of that for a new thing would be sad for them, they wouldn’t like that at all.

Side: Keep cultural mascots
21lcoffey(11) Disputed
2 points

Even if people did have good times they will still remember the good times. If you keep the mascots people will remain offended and stereotyped.

Side: Change cultural mascots
21bedwardson Disputed
2 points

I know that people will still remember them, but if they changed the mascot, they may look back and think of the good times it brought, and if they if it brought good times then that kind of stuff won't matter to them.

Side: Keep cultural mascots
2 points

I think it is not racist towards those people, whether it be Native Americans, African people, or people from the Asian countries. Like I said before, it is not meant to be racist towards them, it is meant to honor them. And by honoring them, we can respect them more and more. For example, when the Marquette Warriors (now the Marquette Golden Eagles), changed their mascot, logo, and everything about their spirit. Plus, Marquette university originally picked the Warriors as their name, logo, and mascot out of respect. So why did they change it if this fact (Marquette university originally picked the Warriors as their name, logo, and mascot out of respect) was stated? Also, in 1983, an official Marquette basketball program stated that, “the symbol for Marquette University’s intercollegiate athletic teams represents the spirit, dignity and strength of the name Warrior. The primary function of the symbol is to serve as a rallying or focal point at intercollegiate athletic events, while promoting cultural awareness of the American Indian.” That’s ironic. If this is the case, why did they change it. It just doesn’t make sense.

http://mu-warrior.blogspot.com/2005/02/why-not-warriors.html

Side: Keep cultural mascots
2 points

Plus, Marquette University chose the nickname Warriors out of respect for Native Americans. In general, mascots are chosen because of the traits they embody, like courage, bravery and leadership. Actually, 83 percent of the Native Americans that took a poll said that professional teams should not stop using Indian/Native American nicknames. Even the apparently “most offensive” mascot/nickname, the Washington Redskins, had an rating (rating of approval) of 69 percent from Native Americans across the nation. Also, it is proven that most Native American tribes like and approve of showing their identity and culture.

http://mu-warrior.blogspot.com/2005/02/why-not-warriors.html

Side: Keep cultural mascots
2 points

My second reason is, team does not choose it’s mascot out of hatred, it chooses out of respect or history. And in this case, a lot of teams choose their mascot out of their own history. For example, For the University of North Dakota, their mascot is ALL about history. For example, they honor the bravery and leadership of the Sioux Tribe. Also, the University of North Dakota made an agreement of using rights to the Sioux as a mascot/name. Their name is now the “Fighting Sioux”. The history is, again, the bravery and leadership of the Sioux Tribe. Plus, with this agreement from very different cultures, this unites both the Native Americans (or the American Indians as they’d like to be called) and the University of North Dakota.

http://www.sioux.org/index.php/main/inner/sioux/our_history

Side: Keep cultural mascots
2 points

Also, back to the “Fighting Sioux”, the history is what made them lean towards the name of, again, the “Fighting Sioux”. For example, there was the battle of “Little Bighorn”. In the battle of “Little Bighorn”, even though they had won their previous battle, they lost this bloody battle to the “whites” as they called (them). And after losing, the Sioux Tribe ended with a stand, proving that even after they had lost, their bravery and leadership would still live one very, very, strong. And that is exactly why the University of North Dakota chose them as their logo and their mascot.

http://www.marketplace.org/2013/10/07/business/cost-retiring-native-american-mascot

Side: Keep cultural mascots
1 point

How many people want to keep it.

In Boiceville, N.Y. home of the Onteora indian high-school teams a protest was lead to get rid of the districts indian mascots. One of the board members, Margaret Carey, helped them succeed in this protest. The district lost their indian mascots on Jan. 24, and the most of the school board members lost their jobs as well when they made this decision. Later a protest was lead to restore the mascot. On Sept. 11 the mascots were restored. So in a time span of 9 months or less it was restored. If people don’t like the mascot then why was it restored in such a short amount of time? Because people want the mascots to stay. This proves that the that the native american people were in the minority when making this decision.

Supporting Evidence: Opposition (docs.google.com)
Side: Keep cultural mascots
1 point

They are meant.

The teams that have indian names aren’t meant to be rude. The teams that choose these name’s are trying to show respect to the Native American culture. Actually Daniel Snyder when approached about this problem mentioned that the team was named the redskins because of the team's first coach, William Henry, because of his native american heritage so they could honor his heritage and the Native Americans. These teams names are named these names because they want to show the bravery of the native americans and support their culture. Their is no evidence that these mascots represent the entire Native Americans culture.

Supporting Evidence: Respect. (espn.go.com)
Side: Keep cultural mascots
1 point

Freedom of speech.

We should keep the cultural mascots because that's what the teams were named a long time ago and they should get to continue to name their teams whatever they want because it is freedom of speech. We named the teams to honor the native americans and now they are wanting to change the names, which would be taking our freedom of speech. If certain individuals are offended by the names then they can use their own rights of freedom of speech to demonstrate against these teams.

Side: Keep cultural mascots